The 50 A circuit breaker did not trip. Renogy Li controllers have a Li selection that charges to 14.4v with no absorb time and no float, ie the batts charge to 14.4v with no temp correction then stop charging until 13.2v when it returns to charging. Here is a video for the PD4655LIV that our team typically references: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjN75eDG8RM. If I want to use a converter, how would I manage the charging profile for a lifepo4 for bulk, float, etc.? 1316 Lakewood Ave SE, Suite L-1 Or adding a 2nd battery, (yours), wired in parallel or connected to the load and separately connected to the car through say the 12v cigar lighter. 775 221 8897. Interesting detective work. I realize you dont handle their products but just their competitors but buying different gear is not an option for me. Thanks for reaching out! I have programmed the regulator with Bulk/Absorb at 14.6V and Float at 13.6V. Yes, the 50 amp charger will be safe for it. What current value would you recommend (since I can program it) ? If you have a higher voltage applied in float(such as 14.6) then we would recommend that this be no longer than 3 weeks at a time. This means that the battery needs to regularly hit at least 14.2 volts (100% SOC) in order for the cell modules to balance internally. Please advise. We modeled this test as if we were end users wanting to preserve our life cycle count of our batteries. Whats best and what do you recommend given you sell both products? Your manual states For your Bulk/Absorption stage, the ideal voltage is between 14.2v-14.6v. This suggests a fixed voltage, rather than a current limited bulk stage. Thanks. Ive used a similar system with an SLA in the past, although the lack of a float mode limited battery life. Advantages or disadvantages to either with your batteries. If I decide to add another in a few months, are there any special procedures that I need to follow? I have a 100 watt panel on the roof and another 200 watts in a portable suitcase in case I need it, and for emergencies, a 2000 watt Yamaha inverter generator. Is there a reason to choose one over the other? I'm glad to hear that you've had a positive experience with their batteries and BMS, but I have a very long list of customers who have had to swap theirs out from between 6 months to 3 years, roughly, due to cell failure/BMS failure/erratic BMS behaviour. You can find more information about our BMS at our FAQs here : https://battlebornbatteries.com/faq/ or give our sales and tech team a call at 855-292-2831 for them to assist. Hi Jim, thanks for reaching out. and how the lifepo4 algorithm is set up. You KNOW this is flawed. This test was meant to demonstrate the functionality of a real world system with AGM versus lithium. Now I can sleep zzzz , Hi, We remove the internal battery from the APC-UPS. You should have discharged to 10.5V and used half the tested capacity. In my application would you advise that I add external charger disconnects to prevent accidental charging, such as from solar panels, until Im sure the battery warms above freezing? The BMS will allow for a 100 amp continuous discharge, 200 amp discharge for 30 seconds and a higher discharge for a 1/2 second. A BMS of 100A, where it has specified that it charges with a maximum of 50 A, is affected if it is subjected to charging directly from the car where the alternator removes 130A? I just reviewed the instructions above and confirmed that I have set everything correctly (a year ago when I installed the system.) The maximum recommended wire gauge is 6 gauge for this unit. Or at the very least have a history of correspondence with them where you are seeking their advice for how their batteries are to be used, and following that to the best of your ability with the info they do provide. Charging a LiFePO4 battery basically means applying an external voltage to drive current from the anode to the cathode of the battery. If youd like, please give our sales and tech team a call at 855-292-2831 so they can further assist. My victron was at 0% SOC and the fridge was still running, drawing over 8amps. The issue with this is that this would drastically limit the AGM batterys life cycles available to the user. Hi Kevin, there are a few differences between the Victron 12/12 30 converter vs the Victron 12/12 30 Smart Charger. Please use this form to request a quote for service for your home or business. Most of the time if it is warm I will be plugging in at night and the Victron Multiplus 3000 can charge the batteries. Setting the float voltage to the minimum allowable value would be the equivalent of this. What Is a Shunt Used for in Electrical Systems? I frequently use my RV in below freezing conditions in the winter. We appreciate you bringing up the point of the 12.2V cutoff. Here are a few FAQ videos that talk about charging LiFePO4 batteries. Hi Christine, thanks for reaching out! Atlanta, GA 30315. In the case with our lithium batteries its about 20 minutes per battery. so just wondering a ballpark charge time for 1 of your 100ah batteries with using a Renogy 12v 40A DC-DC charger. (I think not, but just asking). Charging Lithium batteries requires a voltage in between 14.2-14.6 volts for bulk/absorption, 13.6 or lower for float and should not have an equalization stage. Seems you are you saying you can charge BB 100ah batteries at 100 amps? Is that possible? What do you suggest I set the charger to for the BB10012 batteries? The charger has a lifepo4 setting but the converter can only charge at a constant voltage. Great question. The BMS is programed to handle temperature compensation. Alternatively, if you dont want to or cant use the custom settings then they can just set the retome to the AGM2 battery type and it will still work well to charge our batteries. In this blog series, we will post the results of our tests for a variety of LiFePO4 chargers including converters, inverter chargers, and solar charge controllers. In this case a charger using 14.2-14.6 volts for the bulk and absorb and anywhere between 13.4-13.8 volts for the float is fine. We recommend a bulk and absorption voltage of 14.4 V. A float is unnecessary, since li-ion batteries do not leak charge, but a floating voltage under 13.6 V is fine. If you have any other questions or concerns, please give us a call at 855-292-2831 or send an email to [emailprotected]. Im trying to understand the best way to charge a Lifepo4 battery from my alternator. I may not be using the correct term but battery manufacturers often specify the amount of total capacity available before there is significant voltage drop. Other than for basic setting for battery type to LiPO, kept all other settings default. Bradley, Given that Renogy doesn't actually make anything they sell (they're a branding company, not a manufacturer), it doesn't surprise me that people are getting differing/conflicting information from them about their branded products. The lithium battery charger can behave in several different ways during the charging process. Our sales and tech team is more than happy to help as well, if you give them a call at 855-292-2831 they can walk you through the process live as well. First, the charger can steadily increase its voltage in order to keep the current flow constant. Sorry I forgot to include my name and email on the first comment I sent. Turns out that under load the converter output drops down from the no-load 14.6V. Home | I would also like to build a preset for Battleborn based charging settings using the 14.4v bulk/absorbtion charge volts with a float setting of 13.6v. Our tech team notes that either option will work, but they typically suggest utilizing a PD4655LIV. If you have any questions, please let me know. Trickle charger or something else? I understand that your internal BMS has a low temp disconnect to prevent damaging the cells when charging when the batteries are too cold. All in all, the length of time it takes to charge a li-ion deep cycle battery depends on the type and size of your charging source. What other settings might I need to follow such as times, tail, etc? Please note that at this time we are currently in the middle of our summer sale, so tech calls are being limited to 10 minutes. Is that correct? The BMS does not regulate incoming current, which is why there is a need for a DC to DC charger to regulate flow of current from the alternator to the batteries. I have seen suggestions that holding the batteries at 100% SOC for long duration will impact the battery lifetime is this true? I moved to the mountains in Colorado and with negative and below freezing temperatures common at night, the batteries have been turning offrendering my van a large cooler! We are a technology company that combines Low Voltage Cabling, Access Control, Speaker/Intercom Systems and Phone Services. Depends on the chemistry. Set the float charge to 13.6, the bulk charge should be set to 14.6. Should I make changes for when I am living aboard to when the boat is unattended? You would think they would want to sell their batteries to everyone, but they don't appear to have the expertise to come up with settings for the major brands of chargers and solar controllers. The RC remote is pretty basic remote but you can set it up just like the more advanced remote (ARC50) The parameters are the same: I just received 3 of your 100 ah 12v batteries, do I need to charge them before installing or using them? I know this capacity is typically much better with LiFe batteries sometimes 90%. I have a Magnum hybrid inverter with the ME-BMK. Hey guys is it possible to get more than 100AH out of your batteries? Most of the answers have been estimates and there has been very little documented from Renogy. It was only the "8 each" that confused me. This field is for validation purposes and should be left unchanged. Thanks! Hey there! But, most importantly, we stand by our work! And lastly, I have a 30 volt -10 amp regulated power supply that I think I can use with a voltage limit of 14.2 or so. Or will the BMS provide this function? battery with your Lith. Once the bulk voltage is reached, the charger enters a second stage, called the absorption charging stage. (855) 292-2831 I am looking at sterling power 30 and 60 amp dc to dc chargers. My concern is that the ARC-50 display almost always shows the status as Constant Voltage DC 14.3V. Very rarely do I see the status as Quiet 13.6V. It seems Im holding the batteries at high voltage way too much. Scroll through the menu options until you reach Setup then press to select I understand that the best SOC is between 20% and 95% to maximize the life of the battery. Hi Jose! During absorption, the charger applies a constant voltage, called the absorption voltage. As the batterys open-circuit voltage approaches the absorption voltage, the current flow steadily decreases down to zero. I don't have a diagram yet, but its pretty simplistic, they are just 4 batteries in parallel. If you have a Sterling DC to DC charger (30 amp) For a 6 x100 BB battery bank will it cause damage? I have passed along your email to someone on our sales and tech team to assist with your system troubleshooting. Thanks for reaching out. If you have any additional questions please give our sales and tech team a call at 855-292-2831 or send an email to [emailprotected]. And the white paper study itself here: https://battlebornbatteries.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/Lead-is-Dead-Cold-Charging-LFP-vs-Lead-Acid.pdf Hi Casey! Hey Ernie! When I am running the generator or on shore power the batteries will be charged by the Outback FX. If you have anymore questions please feel free to call us 855-292-2831 or email us at [emailprotected]. A closer look reveals that each algorithm has its own unique parameters, including: Bulk voltage Absorption voltage Absorption time Float Voltage. Please tell me the optimum AMPERAGE level for charging Battle Born 12v 100ah batteries. Thanks for reaching out! The batterys are the Trojan L16H-AC w T2 technology I currently have 8 ea 6vdc battery hooked in series for 48vdc. I believe they will be slow and wont be my first choice. Services I am going to use either one or two BattleBorn 100 AH batteries. This setting provides an accurate SOC result. without subtitles or text translation of vids they are useless for your deaf customers. Charging parameters can be a bit tricky at times and vary depending on the charger and how many stages it allows for. I have two 100ah Battleborn batteries in parrallel. What would be considered the resting voltage of a fully charged Lithium battery, with no load connected? Weve reviewed products that work well with our Battle Born LiFePO4 batteries. This happens OFTEN in the winter in CO; what do you recommend to keep the batteries working, warm and functional? Meanwhile, would it be possible for you to post a simple diagram? I hope to use a 12v 100ah battery in my van and intend to use a DC DC charger. Im running with a Progressive Dynamics PD4575LI which always/only outputs a fix 14.6V, and does not apply a proper bulk charging stage. Does this apply to both discharge and charging currents? All Rights Reserved. The batteries will have effectively NO load on them, and will always be at 100% SOC. See why all of our clients are repeat clients with our exceptional service, attention to detail, and workmanship. Are you in the Northern or Southern hemisphere? Thanks for your comment! Also, join us on Facebook, Instagram, and YouTube to learn more about how lithium battery systems can power your lifestyle, see how others have built their systems, and gain the confidence to get out there and stay out there. Another data point I drained off about 85 Ah (1050 Wh) from a full charge. Battery. We always recommend charging the batteries completely before the initial use. To figure out the appropriate amperage divide the capacity of your battery bank by 2 (For example if you have a 200Ah bank, select 100A). It would be interesting to see how you actually have things configured. Multiplus stays in absorbtion mode for over 12 hours with high voltage and 0 or low current, Quattro 24/5000/120 with 240V split-phase input, Quattro will not stay in "charge" mode longer than 3 seconds. When you charged the AGM in the freezer, did you use temperature compensation? My question is weather you recommend I install additional charger disconnects to protect the battery from charging in freezing conditions or is the BMS designed to disconnect and reconnect when temp rises to a safe level. We did not intend to present misleading data, we believe that the LFP chemistrys performance speaks for itself as to why it is a viable option over AGM. The 12/12 converter is geared towards the use of a non-smart alternator. It is super helpful to know the inter-workings of the batteries and charging. However, a lead-acid battery will rapidly lose charge when the charger is disconnected. What percent increase in battery life would you expect if your battery were only charged in the range 25-35F vs only charged in the range 35-45F? I am currently using Balmar MC-614 regulator connected to 4 100Ah 12V LiFePO batteries in parallel. Recently installed my 2 100AH Battleborn Batteries in my RV and programmed my solar and inverter/charger to your recommended specs. Sometimes we use campgrounds where we are hooked up to shore power for a number of nights and other times solar is our only source. Our team suggests the following settings: Scroll through the menu options until you reach Setup then press to select, Scroll through setup options until you see 03 Charger Setup then press to select this option, Scroll through options until you see 03C Battery Type then press to select, You should see Set Battery Type then scroll until you come to CC/CV then press to select this option. etc. We wouldnt have you limit the SOC to these parameters as the battery can be safely discharged to 0% SOC and we regularly want the battery to reach 100% SOC for balancing purposes. We are proud to feature special A/V installation, sourcing, maintenance and service coverage for Barrow, Bartow, Cherokee, Clarke, Clayton, Coweta, Dawson, Dekalb, Forsyth, Gwinnett, Henry, Oconee, Paulding, Pickens Rockdale, and Walton counties, and the greater Metropolitan Atlanta Area. It does it automatically and I have it setup per your recommendations. battery from the Traction battery. I would check with your battery manufacturer to answer this question for you. You can find the blog here: https://battlebornbatteries.com/lead-is-dead-white-paper-study/ Every day we get questions about charging LiFePO4 batteries and lithium battery chargers. There is no actual charge profile on this unit, and the maximum wire gauge recommended is 10 gauge. Hi Corey, thank you for bringing this to our attention. Hi Jeff, thanks for your comment. Could you elaborate on the process of the disconnect/reconnect if this occurs.. According to research performed by Lifeline, if you discharge your battery to this depth you could stand the risk of reducing your total available life cycles from 1000 to 275 cycles. The BMS will not allow current that exceeds 100 amps for 30s, or 200 amps for 0.5s. You may want to contact the manufacturer of your other lithium battery to see if it is the same per their specs. Thank you for a solid blog/forum page. This will offer a battery that can offer maximum capacity along with even charge and discharge. system except that it does not have an Alt. And for my Magnum Inverter/Charger. Setting the float voltage to be the same as the absorption voltage would be the equivalent of this. Would your LiFePo4 batteries be OK in such an environment? In summary, given that we are talking about guesses and workarounds for very expensive batteries from one of the main suppliers of PV gear for mobile uses in the US, it would be real nice if Victron gave us the option to not have a float voltage and to completely disable equalization, since that is the correct way to work with these batteries. Hi Joshua, thanks for reaching out. Thank you for your help. If you want to get more information about these various conditions you can give us a call at 855-292-2831 or email us at [emailprotected] and one of our sales and tech specialists can help you. I have a 2-100ah bank. Will be nice if you could help me figured out this. Thank you for reaching out and let me know if you have any additional questions. And as for support well, neither we, nor Renogy, nor especially Victron are going to be able to offer support or advice for Renogy products because they didn't make or design them, so no one actually really knows what their specs are. Give us a call for more information on this, 855.292.2831! What Size Marine Battery Do I Need for My Boat? Press to confirm. The Pb battery chargers I know of have a fixed absorption time (which may be programmable) BUT it seems that the best way to charge a Li battery is to switch from absorption to float when the charging current reaches a prescribed value, so I have 2 questions: Do you know of any PV powered chargers that can switch from absorption to float using a external signal (logic level input) and if using a constant but programmable absorption time, what is a good time (for a specific voltage)? The existing trailer converter is a WFCO 8955. In regards to both of your questions, the BMS current limits apply to the discharge only and not the charge rate. At 5 minutes of charging, 13.26 V at 50 A. 100 Amp Continuous Current it has, 14v, 14.2v, 14.4v 14.6v. Im trying to ascertain if my (non-Battleborn) battery has a bad cell, or a bad bms. You can call us at 855-292-2831 or send an email to [emailprotected] if you have any additional questions as well. Im thinking buying 4 packs to let them as spare. Shouldnt they be resting/floating most of the time? So. I could be wrong, this is what I learned : problem with anormal RV battery charger is,:having a float mode? Do you have a setup sheet listing all of the various setting for the ARC50 controller? Exceeding the 0.5C charge rate can prematurely wear down the life cycles of your battery which is why we recommend staying within this specification. Our only concern would be a higher fixed voltage for an extended period of time at 14.2 or greater. We currently use 2 external Alphacell 220 GXL 109AH batteries in serial, connected to an APC Smart-UPS 700. Press to confirm. Current Visibility: Guy Stewart (Victron Community Manager) , Viewable by moderators and the original poster, Please help us Answer the Unanswered Questions. It does not limit the charge current. Our team is reviewing our verbiage to make sure we better reflect this. We do acknowledge that some customers are aware of temperature and load effects on the AGM battery cutoffs, but a vast majority do not know or do not update their programming to reflect this based on their given circumstances. I also have two of the old transformer based 12 volt chargers, a 6 amp Schumacher SE-82-6 and a 15 amp Everstart that I think are safe to use, but would like to hear it from you, if you know. The Intelipower 9200 Charge Wizard chargers will work great with our batteries, but you need to use the 9200 Wired Remote Pendant to force the converter to output a proper voltage in the BOOST MODE. Can the Battle Born 100ah lithium 12V batteries be charged off of the alternator using a battery isolator? Would your batteries work under either or both senarios, or what changes should should I make to accomplish either? A Simple Definition Anyone Can Understand, How to Find a Lithium Battery Installer You Can Trust. Hi Paul, thanks for reaching out. Its a model that we also have in our store in addition to a lot of handy materials created to assist with the install process. Or does it only take a maximum of 50 A? Hi Mark, Yes our batteries can be charged off of the alternator using the Battery Isolator within our Accessories. Good morning Nikki, Thanks for your quick answer, Please let me know if you have any additional questions. The battery voltage had dropped to 11.5V with the load switched off. Contact, info@UptimeAuthority.com 15.3 volts will destroy your batteries, keep it at 14.4v or below. I was hoping to actually get information on charging lifepo4 under various conditions like cold. Home For example, if your charger is 20 amps and you need to charge an empty battery, it will take 5 hours to reach 100%. There are a couple of ways I could interpret your words. Hi there, thank you for reaching out and your patience is appreciated at this time. when charging with an IP65 Victron 12v/15A smart charger do I charge each battery individually or do I connect the negative charging alligator clip to one end of the battery bank and the positive alligator clip to the other end of the battery bank? If left at a half charge, the batteries have the potential to not last as long in storage. Thanks in advance for your help. In some instances we use a single 220 GXL connected to an inverter and a standard marine battery charger. During this process, the batterys open-circuit voltage increases, approaching the applied voltage of the charger. The resting voltage of a fully charged Battle Born Battery is 13.5 to 13.6 volts. But at the same time I have been told that that float voltage will kill the batteries. Hi! Their specs, and design, and BMS have been consistent for a few years for their batteries so Im surprised that is still considered a moving target. I am looking for a drop in replacement to my wet cells that will meet my 60amp A/C requirement, thank you. We also are publishing an FAQ blog post on winterizing your batteries later this month, so stay tuned. Your email address will not be published. Do you sell smaller batteries? We recommend removing the main battery connections if a disconnect switch is not incorporated in your system since our batteries do not require a trickle charge. It should now read Set Recharge Volts and scroll until it reads 13.3V. Products | Am I missing a step with syncing the victron? Our goal is to minimize the heartache of choosing multiple vendors and to provide top notch service for the maintenance and expansion of your business. We guarantee our products, materials, and installation to be of the highest quality available anywhere, and offer warranties with all of our services. The final charge conditions was 14.65V at 270 mA. This is a possiblity as long as you dont exceed 100ah. This alleviates many unforseen issues and coordination conflicts, while providing the best product available. Contact. Im in the early planning stages of a remote, mountain-top (ham radio) communications site which I hope to power using off-grid solar. I have a BB10012. Hi Don, thanks for reaching out! Hi Garret, our recommended charge rate is 50 amps per 100 Ah battery in your system. If you have any other questions or want to talk about all things batteries, you can call our team at 855-292-2831. What is interesting is that in the manual they give the following charge parameters: Based on this chart would it be safe to say that setting the following would be the best course of action for these Renogy LIoN batteries? About Us Your email address will not be published. To figure this time out we recommend 20-30 min per battery (For example if you have 2 batteries set it for 1 hour). I have read many things saying 13.2v, I just want to set my shunt to the correct settings for full charge, so i can have accurate usage readings. https://battlebornbatteries.com/boondocker/. We recently purchased a new KZ Travel Trailer with a 12V refrigerator. This article was suppose to be talking about charging lifepo4 batteries but it instead talks about lead acid battery charging. Sailing Swift is Circumnavigating the Globe with Battle Born Batteries. Charging completed in about 2 hours with 1150 Wh in. I can only speak for our 100AH batteries. I have been doing some research on battery restoration and I think this content may help anyone looking into this product for more help https://bit.ly/3nlQMN8. is low 15 or less. For now, you can set the absorption current between 3-5 amps. Please give us a call at your earliest convenience so we can go over the details. Hi Jason, no damage will occur with the Sterling 30 amp charger on a 6 battery bank, but it will take longer to charge. The Renogy DC to DC charger should take around 2.5 to 3 hours to fully charge a 100 amp battery if there are no significant loads being drawn. We dont have a specific % increase or decrease calculation for these temperatures but around 70F is optimal for maximum life expectancy. It should now show Set max charge Amps and scroll until you reach the appropriate amperage. If I want to charge them now in my home to verify they are ok when I receive them from BB, what is the suggested way to charge them? Please let us know if you have any additional questions. In case you missed my earlier post, regarding the low temp disconnect of the internal BMS. And a follow on question is: why doesnt the BMS limit the charge current to the recommended C/2 (50 amps for the 100ah battery)? Do you ship to Vancouver, Canada, and can you supply an estimated shipping cost? I believe I need to change it to a WFCO 8955-LIs or a PD4655LIV. https://battlebornbatteries.com/lead-is-dead-white-paper-study/, https://battlebornbatteries.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/Lead-is-Dead-Cold-Charging-LFP-vs-Lead-Acid.pdf, https://battlebornbatteries.com/boondocker/, https://www.progressivedyn.com/rv/charge-wizard/pd92201-converter-status-remote-pendant/, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjN75eDG8RM, What Is Energy? Scroll through setup options until you see 03 Charger Setup then press to select this option but charges the Aux. When charging a smaller ah lithium battery such as a 7 to 9 ah do you use the same settings on a programmable ac/dc power converter as you would on a larger ah lithium battery? Hi Corey, thanks for your feedback! Smoke and mirrors to distract from the challenges of low temp LFP charging. At this point, the battery is fully charged. In these cases where Victron has not tested the batteries, and has not been given specific instructions that have been confirmed with the battery manufacturers, the best case is to get the battery supplier or manufacturer to provide the required settings for their batteries. They can be left for many months at a time with the proper multistage charger available. At sunset, the end of solar production will cause the relay to reset, ready for dawn the next day. Toggle Comment visibility. What is the maximum current I might expect your BB10012 to draw with 14.6V applied (likely when it is fully discharged)? We believe you are meaning to respond to our white paper blog. I am looking for the charge settings I need to charge them correctly. etc? Hi James, please give us a call at 855-292-2831 so we can confirm everything and run through your system. I have a lifepo4 with a BMS and trying to charge via alternator in my truck. My charger does not have an absorption limit timer, ( you recommend absorption time to be 30 minutes) it only exits absorption stage on a low current. Once dip switch 5 is set to lithium you can set the charging voltage to 14.4 volts with the other 4 dip switch positions. Absorb done? To begin the series we will discuss the basics of charging batteries, and the products will be covered in other segments. If someone hasnt spoken the obvious. Slight correction: my charge controller is a Magnum ME-RC. The point of this stage is to keep the battery topped off, and account for the fact that lead-acid batteries tend to drain, even when there is no load connected. Good morning Chris! One measurement I have is 45A into the battery at 13.85V, but I dont know the state of charge. cjn. Scroll through options until you see 03C Battery Type then press to select. I really don't want to return these and buy Battleborns as I can only get 500AH of theirs into my battery box and really wanted closer to 700 AH and Renogy seemed to fit the bill.