Ok so the issue is that the access control panel and the IO board are all configured and installed in the control room. If I was in your situation, they'd be my first call. The elevator contractor kept fighting me on it saying he puts CAT6 in the travel cable all the time. I started searching but am having a tough time finding a composite cable that has anything similar to what I'm looking for. Use three NVT devices at elevator synchronized to one and power (and connected to network) in machine room. Shenzhen Lilutong Technology Industry Co.,Ltd, We use cookies to give you the best possible experience on our website. I guess the convertor is gonna have to be my best bet at this point. First of all, why go with an analog camera anywhere? The world's leading video surveillance information source, IPVM provides the best reporting, testing and training for 15,000+ subscribers globally. Most codes allow installation of ancillary devices on top of the cab, with a typical escape hatch clearance of 18". Any ideas on where I can find such cable? Hi. or perhaps a different idea that I'm not seeing? I definitely would NOT use solid core cable in this application. Different Vlan, so putting a switch above the cab would have to be a switch capable of carrying different vlan traffic. I don't know if they can meet your requirements and if so, how cost-effective it might be but they're great folks to deal with and very flexible. (Cat5e,Cat5e,22/6 shld) or something similar. This is very common. The phone pair has always been required. Not sure on the access control solution, but a POE controller here with reader programmed to events and relays in elevator room? Do you have a recommended ethernet over two wire that's reliable long term? My understanding is that cat6 cannot be installed within the traveling cable due to the thin gauge of the cabling. Additionally wireless may be an option especially if they can have it use edge recording and then have the VMS pull the video in every few hours. There is no EMT running to the cab as it moves up and down . I don't want to put a switch above the cab as I see that as a device that may need servicing one day and I know it's not going to be a walk in the park to get to it and take the cab offline. They have to be able to control the elevator in order to route the cable to the car. Can you do VoIP phone, IP camera and an IP access control setup (might require a reader and a local board like an EP1501 that supports Ethernet)? LucyB, September 5, 2017 in Installation Help and Accessories, I doing an install on a 7 floor building and was expecting coax in the traveling cable for the elevator for a camera install but the elevator company said that they don't install coax or cat5 cables as they have seen them break after a few years. You can request whatever flavour of cable you want but I would recommend cat6 within that cable and an IP camera over an analogue camera any day of the week (and I do, it's part of my job). Copyright 2022 Publishers Representatives Limited. Thanks for your input! No the phone will be IP. (even the ones with steel in them), They have handed me 5 X 20/2 AWG shielded wire, I had hoped to do a IP camera and then a coax /POE injector for the camera, http://www.veracityglobal.com/products/ethernet-over-coax-devices/highwire-powerstar.aspx. Wireless is not an option since these feeds need to be monitored in real time. Veracity Global makes a great one that also provides POE over the same coax. I did some more calling around and was told to look for festoon cable? The elevator guys are able to give us some spare pairs out of the existing traveling cable, and each Ethernet connection only needs two wires to function with the Veracity adapters. Trailing cables are ridiculously expensive. wont work too well if they need to see live video however. Card reader is easy to either find spare pairs or add, but they also make an adapter for card readers that gives you power, LED, beeper and wiegand data over two wires - look at CypressIntegration.com. Thank you David, I called them but they were not able to help me. Does the phone have to be analog? The elevators in our facilities use coax, that may be because it was analog at one point. Should your access system not have a single point ethernet controller you can use one of many devices such as this link to convert the signal over IP ethernet. BYPASS ALL THE THINGS! We use this for a custom build. Try Power & Tel (www.ptsupply.com). It's easy! I did some digging - it looks like an Ethernet over coax transceiver can be used - something like this: https://www.nvtphybridge.com/portfolio-item/nv-ec1701/. I suggested providing additional 18AWG coax and using an ethernet over coax transceiver for the IP camera to function. Get updates delivered to your email, once a day, Monday to Friday. External Security Hardware Behind Network Firewall, Lockdown Buttons In A IP Access Control System. We often use Ethernet over coax converters. They make a good hardened product, and are readily available. Obviously clean line of site with power on both sides. Point to Point on Cambium Force 180. this works with all the above load. That way you'd run one CatX cable, and then have a small switch that rides on the car to connect everything together. Try to fish a Cat6 wire through a empty commercial electrical housing shield. It works every time. Ive also talked to a code consultant at my firm and they said per NYC building code, cabling within the elevator travel cable has to be a minimum 20AWG, Due to the concern that any category cable in the travel cable will break after some time from repeated elevator use. The sell all types of cable including underground-rated CAT5 which I've used before. but that looks like that might not be possible any ideas ? POE phone. Ive been going back and forth with the elevator contractor on whether we can install cat6 cabling within the elevator traveling cable. This is a 4 story facility so network cabling distance will not be an issue. PtP wireless or even PtMP mesh in the elevator shaft should be an achievable price point when compared to a hard wire option. In one case we used only one pair for data and installed a power brick inside the cab to create the low voltage for the small switch, camera, and access reader. But I'm with everyone else, use Ethernet over two wire adapters and put a switch above the cab so you aren't responsible for the travel cable. Camera and recorder are all up based . So apologies if this post doesnt belong in this sub. I was thinking the same thing as well but was told they will still not have a long life span do to the fact the cable is 24 awg and the cable pairs will untwist. Ethernet over 2 wires adapter is grate solution, I have Paxton intercom/access control inside the cab running on it. With modern tech getting an IP camera anywhere should be possible. Elevator companies employ the razor/razor blade theorybid very low on the initial elevator installation, and get high fees for every subsequent visit and upgrade. I really don't want to go that route being that I would have to get power to the switch as well as have issues accessing the switch if I ever need to reset or maintain. Which VMS's Run In Linux Or In A Container? We've got them in 30 story elevators and have very little problems. If the video also needs to go to the VMS, bench test if the unit can perform 1:1 with the UBT system and RSTP to the VMS. Which will take all of 20 mins to install. If so, have there been any issues in the long term? They work great, are relatively inexpensive, and don't require any interaction with the elevator co. The IP phone isn't an issue. All rights reserved. I second the idea of using ethernet over copper adapters. Your customer is eventually going to have to upgrade and wont be happy that they have a coax cable there instead of Cat. I've used the Comnet CLFE series with great success. The Elevator ACU is already installed in the control room ready to be connected. Basically if you arrange to have them meet you on-site they will do it provided you have the cable ready to go. Most elevators i have worked with have spare traveler cables. In my experience I have always been told you cannot get Category cable in a travel cable due to the fact it will fail too quickly which makes sense if you look at the construction of the cable. By You would think he would know better.. https://www.deltacab.net/flat-travelling-cable.html. In the elevator penthouse we have a cat6 cable that runs back to a switch on the 7th floor. It's a three floor building. A open board for anyone who works in or has a interest in physical security to share links and ideas. We have always done point to point wireless. If stand alone can be used, bench test Ubiquiti's G3 Micro. (B,1,2). For more details including how to change your cookie settings, please read our, Lead Time We use these with great success. Sorry if these are stupid questions, Ive just recently started to focus more on the technical side of electronic security as opposed to strategy/risk mitigation so am still getting familiar with cabling requirements. would a male BNC break out connector work ? This is the answer. Agree with your wireless as a solution, but would like to see more suggestions with the same price point as Cambium such as Ubiquiti, EnGenius or 2N($$$). I've not done it myself, but I can't see why it wouldn't work just as well. 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Talk to the elevator company, this will be a standard install for them. Copyright 2003 - 2022 CCTVForum.com I always had this as a customer-provided item in the SOW. The last time I personally did phone and access reader in an elevator, it was an analog phone so I just needed two conductors, and the reader I used four or five conductors, I may have skipped using the LED of the reader due to a lack of available conductors.As others have said, I've heard of people just doing a PTP in the elevator shaft. Many IP phones have a switch built in, and the ability pass untagged traffic on the secondary port. Global Sources Sourcing Sites: GlobalSources.com Global Sources Management Site: . We use Veracity adapters to allow for Ethernet over 2 wires - works great. In stud of CatX - better to Go Wireless. I need to get 2 cat5 cables and a 22/6 shielded cable into the cab. We then use ethernet to coax converters or when necessary, ethernet to twisted pair converters. This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply. To answer your question though, every time Ive ever had to do this we always had to have the customers elevator company come out and run the wire for us. 715 Use the NVT two wire poe solution. The elevator company will basically give you two ends of the cable, one in the motor room, one in the car so if you have a POE switch and camera you don't need to worry about getting mains power in the car. How many floors does this building have? If you are responsible for that, there is your pair. What you are looking for is robotic cable. https://www.ascendancewireless.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/SecureLINX-Wiegand-datasheet-1.pdf. https://www.nvtphybridge.com/portfolio-item/nv-ec-1701u/#tab-id-4. Using two or four wires you can get full wiegand data and closures to and from the cab. What will the total length of cable be from the camera in the elevator to the recorder be? Typically Id go with an analog camera in an elevator, but the client specifically stated that it is required to be IP. No separate travel cable required. I am sure someone will link it. 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No one else has been it my shoes before I assume? Once I have this elusive cable I could have in installed and be on my way. Dedicated to independent and objective information, we uniquely refuse any and all advertisements, sponsorship and consulting from manufacturers. We have done numerous IP cameras and access control projects in elevators. Installing analog cameras is bad practice in my opinion. I no longer ask for anything special other than two or four spare wires. I haven't used them in some time but they also make custom cable assemblies. It seems to work for us, very little issue. This was my thought as well. Good evening - I work for a security consulting firm, my main focus is on design of electronic security systems. I have a job that I'm working on that requires a camera, phone and access control reader in an elevator cab.